When Dreams Die: Finding Purpose in the Dirt World
Starting from scratch
You chase a dream your whole life. Baseball. Special Forces. Something that makes you feel alive. Then one day you wake up holding a shovel instead of a trophy. You’re working construction with your brothers. The dream died. Now what?
The questions that won’t quit
Drew Goodman asked every hard question he could think of. Not because he wanted to be difficult. Because he needed to know if any of it was real. God is real. God is good. That’s where Drew landed after a year of digging deep. Not with all the answers. With the right questions. Questions about identity. Purpose. Whether the things he regretted most might actually be shaping him into exactly who he was meant to be.
Your occupation isn’t your calling
Working at Game Inc with his three brothers taught Drew something crucial. Your job is what you do. Your calling is who you are. The system you learn in construction applies everywhere. Marriage. Fatherhood. Leadership. Look around. Help the next person before they ask. That’s the craft. That’s the calling. And when you start asking the right questions about who God created you to be, everything changes.
Episode Summary:
Get ready for a raw conversation about dreams, regret, brotherhood, and the relentless search for purpose. Drew Goodman shares his journey from baseball fields to Special Forces to the grading seat of a heavy civil contractor, where he’s learning that knowing yourself changes everything.
This episode was recorded live at the Dirt World Summit, where construction professionals, heavy equipment operators, and industry leaders gather to build more than roads. Drew’s honesty about faith, identity, and purpose will challenge anyone who thinks they don’t have time for personal development.
Key Takeaways:
- Regret can either haunt you or become your greatest teacher
- You can’t help anyone else if you don’t know who you are
- Faith doesn’t require all the answers, just honesty about the questions
- Self-awareness transforms team dynamics and company culture
- Occupation is your job, but vocation is your calling
- Purpose isn’t found in the uniform you wear but the person you become
Episode Resources:
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Links to the Daron Earlewine Podcast
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EPISODE TRANSCRIPT
Drew: Like looking into my own faith and beliefs, like I let it take me where it takes me. And I don’t know, I still can’t tell you exactly where I am in my faith. God is real, God is great. And outside of that, like I can’t tell you I’m a devout Christian or a Jew or Muslim, whatever, but God is real, God is good. And that’s kind of where I am.
Daron: Created on purpose and for a purpose. Hey, welcome back to the Daron Earlewine podcast. As you can see, this isn’t our new studio, which we just shot the past three episodes in, because I am live in person at the Dirt World Summit. And so you guys may have heard me talk about Dirt World before. It is a movement, I guess you would say, within BuildWit, a great organization based out of Nashville, Tennessee. I’ve got to be connected with them.
And we’re doing some really cool stuff in the dirt world. You say, hey, what’s the dirt world? Well, the dirt world is basically the construction world or any industry that comes from the dirt or works in the dirt. So you’re talking about asphalt, you’re talking about concrete, you’re talking about mining, you’re talking about site prep and dirt moving and just all that stuff. And so this is my third year back at the Dirt World Summit. And it’s been an amazing opportunity for me to meet great people. And I really think that God is doing something unique in this industry. It’s one of the main places that our company, Rogue Collective Coaching, is working in.
Taking some opportunity while we’re here at the summit to sit down with some Rogue Collective clients and just some friends in the dirt industry that I’ve made over the past couple years. So Drew Goodman, welcome to the podcast, really appreciate having you.
Drew: Yeah, dude.
Daron: So Drew, give us a little context. So I’m talking about we’re here at the Dirt World Summit and this idea of Dirt World. A lot of times I talk to people and I’m like, I’m working with the Dirt World. What the heck is the dirt world? So Game Inc, and remind me, you guys are in Washington. We’re in Kennewick, Washington. It’s like Southeast.
Drew: Southeast. Washington state, not DC. Yes, the state of Washington.
Daron: So you guys are a dirt world company. So what does Game Inc do?
Drew: We’re a heavy civil contractor. Move earth, put pipe in the ground, create roads, build subdivisions. All that kind of stuff. Whatever infrastructure you need outside of pretty much building a house.
Daron: What’s your role with Game Inc?
Drew: I’m the grading supervisor. I’m the first on the job site. I get to form the land and whatever we’re trying to build before our pipe guys go in and do what they need to do.
Daron: Okay, awesome. So you guys are in a unique situation that I’ve loved because you’ve got four brothers that are really running the company right now. And you guys didn’t start the company, but give me some context behind Game Inc.
Drew: Dad, my dad did this for probably 20 years before he decided to break off on his own. Started the company on a credit card and just gambled on himself back in 1999. And I think I was 12 at the time. I’m the youngest of the four brothers, so the oldest would have been probably 16 at the time. Summers after we were done graduating high school, we all played baseball. But after baseball, started working for dad, started learning, started at the bottom, water truck, just grunt labor work. And obviously you have enough kids, you got a workforce. You guys all started, you know, finding your niche per se in the company.
And with my brother Chuck, he’s the brains, he’s the smarts. He pretty much started on the ground as well, but his knack was in the office with the bidding, the paperwork, the stuff like that. Marcus, you’ve met him. I mean, client relations guy, you’re not going to keep that guy with a shovel in his hand, right? You’re going to get him people to talk to. Justin, much like my father, he was a pipe guy, was a home man, digging, doing all that. And for me, I was kind of the oddball out until my dad ended up taking, didn’t take over one of his friends company, but one of his friends company wanted out and all he did was grading.
So I started out in a paddle wheel, just started building roads and subdivisions and stuff like that. So my dad put me with him so I could learn that part, which was a huge blessing because it was actually something I truly liked. First doing the pipe, I don’t like you’re burying your work every time. You don’t get to see what you’ve done when you’re forming the earth. You’re like, I just moved that mountain. This is what I got to do today. So I really liked it and then it just kind of created this, you know, four pillars of what Game Inc is now. Justin oversees the pipe, I do the grading. Marcus is the client relations project manager and Chuck is the CEO running the company.
Daron: Okay. So I met you guys last year at the Dirt World Summit and it’s one of my kind of favorite stories of how last year worked in the relationship and the friendships we’ve been able to build this year. So I did the fellowship kind of prayer breakfast thing in the morning. And, you know, I hosted the morning. Didn’t know you guys at all. I think it was just you and Marcus that were there, right? And I think I gave out some free books. You guys got one, whatever. And so we get done with the prayer breakfast, go with a prayer and fellowship deal. Then we go afterwards to breakfast. I get my plate of food and I’m just walking through this huge, you know, 1200 seat place to find a table to eat. And I’m just kind of walking and I don’t know anybody. And I’m like, I walk back to your table with the brothers and it’s like, these guys look younger and kind of cool. Maybe they’ll let me sit with them. And you had an empty seat. So I was like, can I eat breakfast with you guys? And so we just eat breakfast, chat, whatever.
And man, I remember, I don’t know if you remember this, but like, we hung out for like that first like half day and like you were peppering me with some deep ones. Some deep questions like right off the bat, right. And so I loved it, right. Cause it was like, all right, we’re going to have some good conversations. Like, you know, we’re not going to talk about what’s going on in sports or whatever.
And so the interesting thing was, I think there was a break between sessions and you guys left and Marcus was still sitting there and Marcus was like, dude, this is crazy. And I was like, why? He was like, bro, I’ve been trying to grow in my faith and strengthen my faith. And he’s like, I’ve been praying for my brothers forever, for years. And he was like, and I wanted them to come to this thing this morning. And he was like, I didn’t think any of them would come. And he’s like, then Drew came. And you guys are letting him ask questions. You guys are kind of hitting it off. And he’s like, this is just like a dream come true for me. And it’s been so cool.
And then from that, Marcus, I talked to Marcus about doing what we call the flow consult as a part of the Rogue Collective. I was like, well, what about the brothers, you know? And he’s like, I don’t know that they’re probably into it. I’m not sure that they’re ready, whatever. So like the way the story came to me is like, I took him through it and then he evidently came to you guys and was like, hey, I’m doing some stuff with Daron. And then you guys kind of like, dude, when are we, we can’t get in.
Drew: Yeah. It was actually a random email. I think it was probably like on a Wednesday or something like, hey, doing this, doing this stuff with Daron called the Rogue Collective, just started it, but by chance, do any of you want in? And I think I was actually looking at my phone and I was like, yep, I’m in. And right after that, Justin, yep, Chuck, yep. It was no like, hey, what’s it about? I don’t know. Yep, we’re in. So it was, yeah, it was pretty, for him not to think that or whatever is kind of, it is kind of weird because I understand totally where he’s coming from. We, none of us were truly connected to our faith like he was at the time.
Daron: So take me back to that because like here on the podcast, right, we always talk about, I believe God’s created everybody on purpose and for a purpose. We believe God’s formed, not against them, He’s near, He’s not far. And so, you know, I’ve got to walk with you guys now for almost a year. You know, we meet monthly, virtual deal. Hopefully soon I’ll get out and be on site with you guys in Washington. But like, take me through like the Drew journey, right? Like maybe even prior to like last year, cause I would love to know like kind of what was going through your head as far as like, I’m going to see what this guy’s about. Like, you know, in that moment, but before we get to that, let’s reverse a little bit more because, you know, we talk about often on these podcasts too about pursuing this purpose and a lot of times that starts with dreams that God gives us, you know what I mean? Ideas and aspirations we have as a kid and stuff. And so like in your journey, like what was like 12 year old, 16 year old Drew, was it like, yeah, I’m going to go work and build and help build this company Dad started, working with my brothers. Like, what was the dream when you were a kid, man?
Drew: The dream when I was a kid was actually like every kid, I wanted to be a baseball player or some professional athlete. I wanted to be, I wanted to be a professional baseball player. I wanted to be like my older brothers. They weren’t professional baseball players, but in my mind, when your brothers are six years older and you know that they are, they’re it, right? All their friends are it. Like their teams are great. Like I wanted to be as good as them, better than them. That was my dream. Chase that dream.
And five years of college and the whole time I’m in college, I know that I’m going to have a shovel in my hand the rest of my life. And I don’t get a degree after five years of college because I changed my major seven times, I think. It’s like, what am I going to do? I’m going to hold a shovel. There’s no class out here for me to hold a shovel. Where’s shovel 304? Is that down the hall? Where do I take that? Which proper way? I know how to hold one, but tell me the ins and outs of it.
Daron: Were you playing college sports at that point too or no?
Drew: Yeah. So I played down in Milledgeville, Georgia, GCSU. Baseball. Yep.
Daron: Position you played?
Drew: Third base. Justin was better hitter, better defender. I was a better hitter, great defender. So yeah, that’s kind of where I was at in my life was you had your dad and your brothers, I’m going to be where my brothers are. By the time I’m a sophomore in high school, Justin is already working for my dad. Marcus is done with college by the time I’m a junior in high school. Just drifting in the world. He’s working for dad this summer. He’s going to be a loan shark down in San Diego for a little bit. He’s back working for my dad. Now he’s a bartender in Chicago. Now he’s back working construction with my dad. Now he’s back in Chicago doing, he was really searching for his way until he just finally said, you know, I’m going to be with family and put on my roots and try seeds.
Daron: So you’re playing college baseball, pursuing that dream. You’re bouncing around different majors, you’re five years in, the thought of that, like for you, is it like, man, I don’t want to, but eventually maybe I’ll just go back. Like, did it feel like a demotion or something that like was like, kind of like it was haunting you? Like this is maybe what you’re going to have to do. Or was it like, no, this would be a good deal to go back home and do this.
Drew: For me, being naive, I remember throughout high school, my dad started this company in our back room and I would wake up at 6 AM to be a part of the group conversation, the pre-job, to see the guys, talk to them. And so I always was like, I don’t know, I’m going to be a construction worker when I grow up. And when I got done with baseball and I got to go be a construction worker, it was, man, it was a real punch in the face. It was like, wow, this isn’t exactly what I thought it was.
And the thing I think that was so hard for me was there’s a, it’s a craft and you have to get good at that craft. It’s not just like, oh, you go out there, it’s just a bunch of guys just doing a job and like camaraderie is there of course, but it’s something you’ve got to like, you’ve got to pay attention to. You’ve got to learn it. You’ve got to know what you’re doing. And if you don’t, the day sucks and you get picked on, you get, because you’re making everybody else’s life harder when you screw stuff up. And that’s what I didn’t understand when I first got back from college. It’s like, man, they’re always busting my balls. They’re giving me a hard time. I’m like doing the best that I can. Nobody’s giving you any direction because they’re worried about what they’re doing.
And which is tough, but it’s also that generation of guys like, you better figure it out. And I think it was kind of tail drift on that. I think it was two years, 2014. I broke up with my girlfriend, who’s my wife now. So we were together for two years, took a two year absence. So during this breakup, I’m working construction. I’m miserable. I’m not making it my craft. I’m not taking it seriously. It’s winter time. So we’re basically laid off and I watched a Discovery documentary on all the special operations in the military and decided that I wanted to sign up and go Army SF.
And went down there, signed up, got an 18 X-ray contract to go Army SF. Talked to my whole family, like felt like a proud moment for me. Oh man, that’s what I’m going to do. And the love was felt with fear. Like I just remember my brothers like, whoa, what are you doing? Like, why, like where did this come from? Why are you going to go and do that? Like, do you need to do that? Like all blah, blah. I was like, oh man, I thought everybody would be like, give me high fives. Well, blah, blah. Anyways, long kind of long story short, I ended up deciding, I ended up backing out of the contract before I went off to bootcamp and that time, that job that we were on was like, okay, well you backed out of this, so you’re committed to construction now. There’s really nothing else that you’re going to, you’re not going to go back and try to do it again.
So that was the first job that I truly remember like, okay, I’m going to learn what needs to happen. And it changed my life in a lot of ways, not just as a construction worker, but as like a human. Like there is a system to everything. To your marriage, being a father, being a good worker, whatever your job is. Like if you learn the system and you can try to help out the next person before they ask for your help. I mean, how much better is their life because of your just looking around and kind of absorbing what needs to be done.
Daron: Go back. What do you think? Cause I’d never heard this part of the story before in the past year. What do you think your brothers were feeling where you got kind of this negative or this kind of fearful, like anger response was like, you’re deserting us or this was supposed to be the plan. Like, have you guys talked about what do you think was behind some of that?
Drew: I think they probably thought I was going to go die. It was like protective. I think it was more of a fear of like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Like why, why are you going over there? Because it was, I mean, it was, I was going Army SF, which would have been a huge dream of mine. And to this day is my biggest regret that I didn’t go and give that a go. But a lot of that wasn’t just so much of what they were saying, but it was also my own self doubt. Like, oh man, if I don’t make it, like I’m going to be Army infantry, which isn’t a bad thing, but it’s not what the dream was, right? Like it would be, oh now I’m, now I’m stuck in this that I’d like, I wanted to be that.
And so that self doubt, plus like the brothers being like, basically stay around. And that was something that I probably haven’t heard, right? Like, no, no, no, we want you to stay with us. Oh, well, if you want me here, my dad, my mom, two brothers, a couple of my friends like, whoa, you can’t leave. It’s like, wait, you want me to stay? Oh, okay. Well that’s totally different. You always say, yeah, I mean I’ll stay. So I think it came out of fear. I mean, you have to talk to them on what they felt when they heard that news. It wasn’t received the way that I truly thought, because we were very pro-America, pro all of that. And I thought some high fives. I thought like, this is my boy. Let me tell you about my son. And it wasn’t that way, which now that I’m a father, I can see how that news can strike you.
It was never, I don’t even think anybody knew I was going down to the recruiter’s office or doing all the ASVAB tests and the, to try to get to the 18 X-ray contract. So it was just like, I don’t know where all of a sudden it was like, well, when it was like, I realized what could entail, what could come with this.
Daron: So that’s massive. And I, and man, I, I like, I’d love to off the podcast, just dig into like that, how that regret messed with you or motivated you. Maybe we talk about it now. Because I think that’s a massive thing, man. Because we all have these dreams. That was one of them for you. Baseball was one of them. Special Forces is one of them. And when it doesn’t work out the way we think it’s going to work out, I think there’s a place. I believe it’s a chapter in the book where my book talks about that everything’s woven by God, not wasted.
And a lot of times we see these times where we go after something and it fails or we don’t go after something and it’s like, man, I just wasted that opportunity or I wasted that relationship or whatever it is. And what I’ve seen in my life over and over again and thousands of people’s lives is like, man, God is so good. He’s always at work redeeming and weaving together. It didn’t happen like this, but I was teaching you this. I’m going to use this. And I think we have to get to that place of trusting that or else I think the regret messes with us more than it becomes something that begins to mold and motivate us. So were there weeks, months, were there years after you didn’t go for the special forces? Was it, did it mess with you or did it motivate you?
Drew: It still haunts me to this day. Really? Yes. My, by far my biggest regret in life. But like I’ve told my wife, like after I got married, my wife sees this disappointment anytime I do the Frogman, they come down and I get to do that camaraderie with them.
Daron: Tell us what the Frogman is.
Drew: Frogman is a charity event that me and my family put on. It benefits the Best Defense Foundation, but essentially I wanted to start a golf tournament that was a best ball, not a scramble for you golfers that are listening to this. That was for charity and I wanted it to be for special operators. I found a Navy SEAL Foundation called the SFF, the SEAL Future Fund, started it with them and moved over to the Best Defense Foundation, which is a World War II foundation. They take the surviving, the few survivors back and go and document their stories. It’s very, very, very touching videos that they do. A lot of them are on YouTube. You get a chance, you’ll start tearing up.
But being able to hang out with those SEALs for that weekend and hearing their stories and hearing the things that they went through and a lot of the things that drove me or motivated, it’s the suffering, it’s hearing about Hell Week, it’s hearing about the stuff that they’ve done, whatever, and it’s like, man, like, could you have done that? And that’s why it’s a regret for me is because you’ll never know. You don’t know if you’re going to pass, you don’t know if you’re going to go through selection and make selection. You don’t know that. You can think that, oh man, I’m rough and tough and I can do it and I can prepare and I can do it.
But until you do it, you don’t know. Because they don’t, like we were talking last night, you don’t know. They’ve done so many studies on who should you recruit to be a Navy SEAL. Navy SEAL and Army SF is different, but it’s the same story of who should you try to pick. And you don’t know. You don’t know who’s going to make it. And so for me, it’s you have the wife that believes, you know, oh man, you would have been great. Yeah, I don’t know. I don’t know if I would have failed. I don’t know if I would have made it. I don’t know if I would have loved it. I don’t know if I would have hated it.
But you talk to these guys and most of them, they have trouble coming back into civilization, the civilian world because they want to be over there with their brothers.
Daron: Yeah. And I’ve heard a guy who was a sniper, we were at Walter Reed hospital touring, doing some stuff and I had a guy, they would do these T-shirts, French troops and come and do some prayer for him and stuff. And we were walking around with him and he said, the thing about it is he’s like, they do everything they can to make you a great soldier. The difficult part is when you become a great soldier, it’s tougher to ever become a good civilian. You know what I mean? So do you, I mean, do you have, have you ever thought, do you think there could have been a thought where in some ways maybe God was protecting you in that?
Drew: I think so. I mean, God is great and obviously knows much more than we will ever know. So I mean, I do that and I don’t back out. I don’t have my wife, I don’t have my kids. I don’t have this company with my brothers. Life’s totally different. I love where I’m at in my life. You still have your regrets in your life, but it’s not a regret I ruined my life by any means.
Yeah, I told my wife many times, I wouldn’t change it for the world. I’d still regret it, but I’m so much happier than I ever thought I could be in life because I am a dad and a husband and a business owner with my brothers.
Daron: Now let’s rewind or fast forward both back to a year ago when we meet. So through you pursuing that kind of the death of that dream up until we meet a year ago, where was like faith at in that process for you? Was it not on the radar at all? Was it kind of on the back burner? Was it kind of something you were against? Kind of what did that relationship with God look like through that?
Drew: To be honest with you, faith for me was, it was common sense based. Growing up through schooling and stuff like that, never believed in the Big Bang Theory, never believed in evolution. It was just my personal belief, all scientists out there don’t want to get into that, but it just seems like something had to create all of this. Something had to create the beginning and what happened from there, I didn’t know. And since I didn’t know, I didn’t dive in. So it was more of a, there is a God, I know God speaks to me because there’s things that, there’s no way I should have known what to do. They do.
Daron: So he’s there, but he’s kind of distant, not real personal.
Drew: Exactly. He’s there. You feel him, you know he’s there. But I’m not going to dive in and figure out anything else. The belief is there. The knowledge is there. And that’s why Marcus really struggled getting me into the faith path that he’s on. It’s because all the questions that I hammered you with within the first 10 minutes of meeting you, I had to hammer him and he’s so new and doesn’t want to lead me astray. And I’m looking at things from a left-handed upside down angle of being like, well, what about this? He’s like, I don’t even know why you would even think, I can’t answer that. I don’t know. Let me ask my pastor. Where did this question come from? It’s my brother. I don’t know. If you can answer it, that’d be cool. If you don’t have an answer for it, I’ll tell him he’s just, he’s a moron.
So having the chance to talk to you, I’m like, bam, perfect. Come on, sit down. Perfect. No, right here, pal. No, come here. We need to have a real quick conversation. So tell me about this. So that’s what it was like for me. And after talking to you and after kind of just doing my own, not research or anything like that, but just like looking into my own faith and beliefs. Like I let it take me where it takes me. And I don’t know, I still can’t tell you exactly where I am in my faith. God is real, God is great. And outside of that, like I can’t tell you I’m a devout Christian or a Jew or Muslim, whatever, but God is real, God is good. And that’s kind of where I’m at right now.
Daron: So what I love about it, man, is like now through what we’ve gone through over the past year, going through some of the Rogue Collective material, like, you know, we know as far as what motivates you, you know, why you do what you do. You know, you’re an Enneagram eight, right? You’re a challenger, right? You’re looking to, you know, show strength and push away the weakness. You’re looking to challenge things. You want truth. Like those things are important to you, virtue and justice and, and like, you know, when I first met you, it’s like, I could see that and be like, I could guess like probably, probably what we’re dealing with here is an eight that once, you know, once like, let’s go, let’s have a debate. Like I love it, you know?
And dude, I love that part of the journey that you’re on and getting to watch it over the past year of like, my guess is that Drew Goodman has never just accepted things as people told him it had to be or should be as probably your whole life. Like you had to go out, you had to prove it, you had to figure it out, you had to dive in. And man, I think that’s just an awesome way that God’s created you. And I’ve just loved watching you just search, discover, you know what I mean? And ask a freaking hard, but really great questions. I think it’s a beautiful part of your personality and I really appreciate that.
Drew: It’s caused me a lot of headache in life and a lot of beatings from my brothers. So, especially when you’re the youngest, call it virtue. I mean, that’s great. They’re going to watch this episode and be like, yeah, that’s Drew. Nope. He’s got to prove it. He’s got to prove himself wrong or right every single time until he proves himself wrong or right. He’s always right. So yeah, that’s, I mean, that’s been me. This Rogue Collective thing and going through kind of the baggage in the past and relating that to faith has been, it’s been life changing. It’s been really good for me.
Like I told you last night, I kind of debrief with my wife after each one of our sessions that we have and get her take on things and kind of hear her perspective. And more times than not it’s met from her and be like, wow, like I’ve always wanted you to look into that, or I’ve always wanted to say that to you, or I can’t believe that you know that about yourself, or I’ve known that the whole time. So that, I mean, for me, that’s been great, because you don’t know what you don’t know.
Daron: Yeah, it’s like there’s so many things, man, that I think for all of us, like the overarching term we could use, like a self-awareness, right? But man, when we have, you know, some of the stuff we’ve been able to go through with the Rogue Collective, when we go through like the flow consult, man, we got to look at like your whole, and it was one of the, one by far, I think has been my favorite coaching moment when we did the flow consult with you four brothers, because I’ve never had an opportunity to go with four brothers. And what I thought was fascinating, Drew is like, I mean, you know, it wasn’t all sunshine and rainbows for you guys growing up. And to hear, man, each of you tell your childhood story where like you’re in the same family and there’s some different kind of mixed, you know, blended family dynamics.
But like, man, here’s what life was like for me growing up and seeing, you know, different brothers be like, I never knew you felt that way. Like, man, I would have, I think I would have acted different or I would have been there for you different and like, but to be able to see, and then some of my favorite parts have been when you guys have been able to speak affirmations and speak, you know, the things they see and the truths they see and as you guys see in one another, like what has been so awesome for me to watch is it’s almost like your guys’ self-awareness of who God has created you to be has grown so much, but also at the same time, hearing, you know, your wife, hearing your brothers like say, we see this in you, we believe in this about you, like we wish you would have known this before. Like it’s, it’s inspired me to watch you guys grow in that. But like, what has that been like for you? And like, what is it like? What’s that dynamic? What’s it done to your relationships as brothers? You know what I mean? Your relationship with your wife and you’ve already hit on that a little bit, but like, what are you seeing in that experience from them?
Drew: It’s kind of totally that day that the sessions are usually on our, kind of the more in depth ones are the more heartfelt ones. Usually one of us will reach out to another on kind of what you’re saying. I didn’t know you felt that way or I don’t remember that story like that and you telling it like that, like, man, I’m sorry. But as for a whole, I think all of us brothers are so close that like hearing the things about Marcus and hearing things about Justin, it’s kind of like, those are the things that you knew in your heart the whole time. So how they saw life or how they felt they were treating you or like, that’s kind of the in-depth stuff. But when it comes to, no one will ever know you more better than your brothers know you, I think. Especially if you’re close.
So that being that I wasn’t always around during that time. Like hearing my brother Chuck’s one was very impactful for me because that’s a story that I didn’t know. I wasn’t as close with Chuck as I was with Marcus and Justin, but that, hearing that and going through that with Chuck was huge for me for the point that you’re making.
Daron: Do you think it’s given you guys like a higher level of like empathy or patience or belief in each other in the process? What kind of, what maybe word or emotion would you put to it?
Drew: Empathy, I lack in that terribly. So probably not that, maybe more ammunition to make fun of them and bust their balls a little bit. That’s usually where it comes down to is you open up and then you just get, you get a snowball thrown at you. But you know, the things that truly hit you in the heart are not so much the empathetic things. I think it’s the motivating things that you said. It’s affirmations. It’s that, we’ve always known that you are so-and-so or that you’re great at this or that we’ve always loved you for this. What you think is a deficiency in you or a defect is our favorite part of you.
Daron: We talked about last night, we sat in the bar last night till 2 AM because you wouldn’t go to bed. I’m glad you said let’s go to bed finally.
Drew: I was waiting, I just couldn’t be the first one gone.
Daron: It was a competitive thing. You couldn’t quit early. You know what’s funny is I’m sitting there the whole time being like, well, Drew didn’t say we had to go to bed. I mean, I wanted to go to bed like an hour and a half before we did. So anyway, we stayed up until 2 AM last night, but we talked a little bit about like, you know, man, how tough like the identity piece is of being like, you know, man, I’m just a piece of garbage, man, I’m not worth it, or I’m this and like, man, all the failures, all the regrets, all the stuff we’ve gone through in our life, man, it just, it screams at us. And I think it’s so hard for us to like, to truly understand like, man, who am I really?
And I think it’s massive when people we love can see and speak into identity. I think the biggest thing, you know, when I’ve been walking with you guys is like, man, you think it’s awesome when your brother tells you something or your wife tells you, but man, when you start to hear from the source, like when you hear from the God who created you and he’s like, listen, I know who you are. I know your name. Like I’m not distant. I’m personal. Like I created you on purpose and for a purpose and like, I’m letting you walk yourself into really understand and really hear. Like when I see Drew, this is what I see in him. This is what I say about him. And I think that that’s for me in my life. When I’ve seen people like that, that’s when the revolution really happens. That’s when the transformation really happens.
And so, I mean, watching that little by little, and I love how honest you are. Like, man, I don’t know where I’m at right now. I’m still walking the journey. And I love that, the honesty of that. And I think what I hope to be a part of in your life, Drew, being able to help ask you good questions and be able to help just kind of walk with you into the place where because you’re the kind of person, Drew, when you get to the place of you like, I believe it and I’m dedicated to it and this is what I’m giving my life to, you do it 100%. And man, I’m just excited to see the impact that your life has on your wife, on your brothers, on your children, on your children’s children.
It’s been so cool, man. And like I’ve told you guys multiple times in our sessions, like when I feel like what you guys are doing at Game Inc and the investment you’re making in yourselves and in one another, like I think the potential here is for a culture in this company to be built that will become like a gold standard in the industry. And I think the impact that you’re going to have is 100x. And so with that thought, like let’s say somebody’s watching, but they’re in the dirt world. We drop this episode and they’re like, I’ve heard about this Daron guy. I’ve heard about this Rogue stuff, but like we’re a freaking dirt company, right? We move dirt, right? We put pipe in the ground, like we’re in the trenches and it’s a man’s man’s kind of situation. Like this is 60, 70, 80 hour work weeks. Like we don’t have time to sit around and talk about, you know, identity and core motivations. And we’re not sure we’re going to bring the God thing into it. Like what would you say like to someone who might be like, no, like it’s, you know, we don’t have time to work on relationships. We don’t have time to work on our own development. Is it worth the time?
Drew: My opinion, I mean, if you don’t take the time to find out A, who you are, which selfishly was one of the things that I really wanted to do, the Rogue Collective was, because I wanted to find out more about myself. I was surprised at what I found out more about my brothers and stuff like that. But as you go through it, you kind of, it’s impossible not to want to almost go through it with other people in your company or this team within your company needs to go through this so they can understand themselves better. I’m tired of them bickering or fighting or, you know, how can I make this team as close as the other team? Well, you don’t know why that team’s so close and you should probably find out and if you can, then you could probably duplicate that.
If you’re ever going to do that, you need to learn about them and they need to learn about themselves. That’s for me, I think that that’s the biggest thing is if you don’t know who you are, how could you ever help anybody else? Cause you know, you think that you’re going to be that great seven or whatever in your two for those non-Enneagram guys. There’s a bunch of those podcasts.
So I mean, if you think you’re a great motivator and really you’re meant to be a supporter, then I mean, your team dynamic’s just wrong and you don’t go through that with yourself, then you’re never going to look at your teammate in the correct light because you don’t even know who you are. Everybody always says they don’t have time for whatever they don’t want to do. You know, we all have the same amount of time in life. And if you don’t take the time now, it’s just going to take so much longer. I mean, you’re only going to keep going backwards, right?
So I personally think that if it even seems like it fits you, it’s absolutely worth a try. And you’re not going to regret what you at least learn about yourself, how your team, I’m lucky enough to go through with my brothers so I can call their BS on anything that they say and be like, dude, that’s not how that happened or that’s not who you actually are. You don’t actually believe that you’re faking this. I couldn’t necessarily do that if it was with my coworkers or something like that, because I don’t know what they truly believe. But I do know I still would have learned about myself. And even if that coworker or yourself learns more about themselves. I bet you they look at everything in a little bit of a different light.
Daron: So yeah, I love it. I love it, dude. All right. Let’s land the plane with this kind of question. So we’ve talked about the past. Let’s look on the future a little bit, right? So like, what do you see in your future for you? What do you think the trajectory you’re on right now? Where are you going to be in five years? What do you think’s happening in your life right now?
Drew: Wow, that is, I know, that’s a big question. We’re going to go from 30,000 feet above. Where I, you know, I don’t, I’m kind of where I’m at right now and hopefully just a better version of myself. I love how close we are with the guys in our company and how close our company is with each other. I love being with my brothers. I love where my life is right now with my marriage and my kids and all of that. I mean, five years from now, like being a better version of that and whether or not we keep scaling and growing, I hope we do so with the same culture that we have. I hope whatever does come of this, it doesn’t break into all the brothers kind of go their separate ways to grow the company in a sense. Like whatever we do, I hope we do it together. But I want to, in five years, be in a better situation to impact more people in whatever God has for me in that sense.
Daron: Can I tell you what I think I see?
Drew: Yes, please. That’s why I’m doing the Rogue Collective. Thank you.
Daron: This is going to be a groundbreaking moment. This is the first take here, Drew. Dude, here’s what I think I see. And I had this thought last night while we were hanging out is the way you talked about finding purpose last night, right, is I would say it’s not normative for me to talk to somebody who has a, like when you talk about it, like I can see the intensity. Like I want to know my purpose. And like, I think everyone gut level feels that, but I don’t talk to a lot of people where it’s like, like, no, I’m hunting it down. Right.
And like you tell your story, you would not have had time probably to tell the story, but you tell your story about your high school buddy who like loved the Miami Dolphins so much, doing his own podcast. Then he becomes the Miami Dolphins podcast guy, right? Moves from freaking Washington to Miami, right? It’s like, it’s abnormal. Like why the hell does this guy love the Miami Dolphins so much? But it becomes this deal, right?
And what I can see for you is I think God has you on a journey, Drew, to help you discover the thing that you care about more than anything. And my hope and prayer for you in the process is I think you’re going to come to discover that following Jesus is the most crazy, dangerous, exciting, like mission you could ever have. And like, He is the greatest, you know, challenger, you know? And I think there’s a beautiful heart in that for you in this zest for like justice and things being right and people being the best they can be. Like last night when you were talking about like the reason you like coaching kids, you know what I mean?
And I think for you, man, we talk about this, you know, in the Rogue Collective stuff is there’s a massive difference between occupation and vocation, right? Occupation is our job, right? It’s the uniform we wear. Our vocation, our calling is who we are. And man, what I think I see for you is I don’t know that your occupation will change. I think you guys are going to be about building a world-class company. But I think there’s a vocation, there’s a calling that you’re walking into right now. I don’t think it’s new. I think there’s been pieces that God’s been planting in your life for a long time. And dude, I hope we get to walk together as friends long enough for me to give you a big hug one day when you’re like, this is why I was put on earth, man, this is it. And you’re going to do it with a lot of freaking passion, a lot of zest, a lot of intensity, dude. And I’m here for it, man.
Drew: I appreciate it. I hope I figure out what that is, because I want to give them my all, and that’s where the passion comes from. It’s knowing that God put you here for a reason.
Daron: One day at a time. One good question at a time.
Drew: Yes, yes, and I’ll keep asking. Whether they’re good or not.
Daron: Oh, dude, Drew, thanks for taking the time, man, to sit down and have a conversation. Let’s hang out tonight and have some more fun.
Drew: Okay. But I have to do the thing tomorrow at 6 AM, so we can’t stay up till 2 tonight.
Daron: Yeah, yeah, no, I’m going to that thing at 6 AM, so we won’t. Hey, listen, thanks for downloading this episode of the Daron Earlewine podcast, whether it’s on YouTube, Spotify, wherever you listen, wherever you download it. If you’re not a subscriber yet, please click the button, subscribe to the channel. And if you have any questions, I always say this, I would love to hear from you. Just email me at Daron at DaronEarlewine.com. I would love to be in the conversation with you. And until we talk next time, remember these three things. God’s for you, he’s not against you, he is near you, he’s not far away, and he’s created you on purpose and for a purpose. We’ll talk to you next time on the Daron Earlewine Podcast.